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	<title>Comments on: Pulling Back the Curtain: Opening up the CSS Working Group</title>
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	<description>All you ever needed to know about CSS3</description>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Ian Hickson</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-126052</link>
		<dc:creator>Ian Hickson</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 28 Mar 2008 20:57:52 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-126052</guid>
		<description>Openness is about who can contribute, not about who can edit. Editing is about consistency and having one person with ultimate responsibility for making the spec a good spec.

The two are very different.

Having meetings where not everyone can participate but where decisions are made (e.g. face to face meetings, teleconferences) is &quot;closed&quot;, and doesn&#039;t allow for open participation.

Having a committee decide on editing means that no one person is fully responsible for the spec, and that automatically means that you get a lower quality spec. People do better work when they are going to carry the full blame if the result is bad. Committee-driven design is well-known for being a bad way of designing languages (and indeed, almost anything else).

What CSS needs, and what the WHATWG group has, but what you don&#039;t seem to have realised is the key to the success of the WHATWG, is the combination of _anyone_ being able to send and discuss feedback, and one person, asynchronously taking _all_ feedback into account and attempting to come up with the best solution to satisfy everyone&#039;s feedback.

In the CSS group what we mostly see is feedback being dismissed instead of considered, language decisions being made in a committee instead of with the overall vision and consistency that a single editor provides, and the opinions of some working group members being given disproportional weight instead of all opinions being taken at face value.

Being transparent will make this more obvious, and thus should help push the group into the right direction, but it is not, in and of itself, the real solution to the specification quality problem CSS has.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Openness is about who can contribute, not about who can edit. Editing is about consistency and having one person with ultimate responsibility for making the spec a good spec.</p>
<p>The two are very different.</p>
<p>Having meetings where not everyone can participate but where decisions are made (e.g. face to face meetings, teleconferences) is &#8220;closed&#8221;, and doesn&#8217;t allow for open participation.</p>
<p>Having a committee decide on editing means that no one person is fully responsible for the spec, and that automatically means that you get a lower quality spec. People do better work when they are going to carry the full blame if the result is bad. Committee-driven design is well-known for being a bad way of designing languages (and indeed, almost anything else).</p>
<p>What CSS needs, and what the WHATWG group has, but what you don&#8217;t seem to have realised is the key to the success of the WHATWG, is the combination of _anyone_ being able to send and discuss feedback, and one person, asynchronously taking _all_ feedback into account and attempting to come up with the best solution to satisfy everyone&#8217;s feedback.</p>
<p>In the CSS group what we mostly see is feedback being dismissed instead of considered, language decisions being made in a committee instead of with the overall vision and consistency that a single editor provides, and the opinions of some working group members being given disproportional weight instead of all opinions being taken at face value.</p>
<p>Being transparent will make this more obvious, and thus should help push the group into the right direction, but it is not, in and of itself, the real solution to the specification quality problem CSS has.</p>
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	<item>
		<title>By: Dan Connolly</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-31473</link>
		<dc:creator>Dan Connolly</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 19 Jul 2007 22:40:24 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-31473</guid>
		<description>indeed, well said. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>indeed, well said. Thanks!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chris Lilley</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-31318</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris Lilley</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 18 Jul 2007 18:04:26 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-31318</guid>
		<description>Fantasai, your thoughtful blog posting was discussed at the W3C management meeting today; we were looking for ways to improve the situation and your suggestions were very helpful in that. Thanks!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Fantasai, your thoughtful blog posting was discussed at the W3C management meeting today; we were looking for ways to improve the situation and your suggestions were very helpful in that. Thanks!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: @media, CSS 3, and browser news &#187; Broken Links</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-25069</link>
		<dc:creator>@media, CSS 3, and browser news &#187; Broken Links</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 23:58:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-25069</guid>
		<description>[...] there are a couple of lengthy but interesting posts on CSS3.info (part one, part two) explaining the situation and progress of CSS 3, written by one of the invited experts. Worth a [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] there are a couple of lengthy but interesting posts on CSS3.info (part one, part two) explaining the situation and progress of CSS 3, written by one of the invited experts. Worth a [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Joost de Valk</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-24955</link>
		<dc:creator>Joost de Valk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:26:56 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-24955</guid>
		<description>David: I was notified of that ;) sorry to fantasai, updated the post ;)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David: I was notified of that ;) sorry to fantasai, updated the post ;)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Joost de Valk</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-24953</link>
		<dc:creator>Joost de Valk</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:26:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-24953</guid>
		<description>Personally, I&#039;m very very happy to see two points here: that the csswg is starting a weblog, and the sentence &quot;Interact more with sites like css3.info.&quot; is very flattering of course :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Personally, I&#8217;m very very happy to see two points here: that the csswg is starting a weblog, and the sentence &#8220;Interact more with sites like css3.info.&#8221; is very flattering of course :)</p>
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	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: David</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-24952</link>
		<dc:creator>David</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 18:25:25 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-24952</guid>
		<description>fantasai is a she.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>fantasai is a she.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Behind the Scenes: What is the CSS Working Group doing? - CSS3 . Info</title>
		<link>http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/comment-page-1/#comment-24920</link>
		<dc:creator>Behind the Scenes: What is the CSS Working Group doing? - CSS3 . Info</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jun 2007 17:50:20 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.css3.info/pulling-back-the-curtain-opening-up-the-css-working-group/#comment-24920</guid>
		<description>[...] Continue: problems I see and how Ithink we should address them. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] Continue: problems I see and how Ithink we should address them. [...]</p>
]]></content:encoded>
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